Allow swimming pool?

[BSH]

Hello. I was wondering if you fellow landlords (and attorneys and insurance gurus) could give me some advice here.

I have a tenant who has requested permission to install a small above-ground swimming pool in her back yard. This pool is 8' in diameter and approximately 30" high. She has already said she would install a fence around the pool and remove it when she moved.

I am debating whether or not to allow the pool. Ordinarily, for any of my other tenants, I would have automatically said no because of the liability and whatnot. However, she is a stellar tenant who takes better care of the place than I ever have. When she says she will remove it, I would put money on her word--she has always been very up-front and beyond honest with me.

I've already talked to my insurance--they wouldn't cancel my policy or raise my premium, strangely enough. I talked briefly with an attorney who said his only concern is that legally the liability falls on me if anyone is injured or worse.

My husband says go ahead and allow the pool. I'm hesitant. My gut says don't do it--just because of the liability aspects of things. Yes, I'm insured to the hilt, but so far I've had not one single claim, and I'm trying to keep it that way.

I'm looking for thoughts, feelings and opinions of others who have been at this longer than I have. On the one hand, my heart wants to accommodate a single mother and her young daughter; on the other hand, my head says this is not a good idea.

What do you think?

Thank you for your help!!!

[joe]

In-ground pools create liability to you.tell tenant they are responsible for all non attached items.NOT AN ATTORNEY.

[Debbie]

Hubby and I are landlords so I relate to what you're saying....

Whether insurance companies says yes or no, DO NOT ALLOW IT!

Why? A neighbor's child gets hurt. A tenant's child gets hurt. A tenant's niece or nephew gets hurt. A pet (tenant or neighbor) gets hurt.

Another why--tenant failed to secure the gate. Tenant failed to use professional made fence.

Another why--everyone knows that tenants are "poor" while Landlords are "rich". There will be a lawsuit waiting to happen---it's a guarantee!

While it is fine for landlord to provide something that is of the necessity to the tenant, a pool is NOT a necessity! Plus, a pool is also NOT a priority.

If it means losing a "stellar" tenant, so be it.

Once, we had a "stellar" tenant who put in similiar sized pool without our permission. Luckily, we already had privacy fence.

What brought our attention about this pool? We were there for inspection in late May--no pool there nor was there any request for one. Three weeks later, tenant (unmarried couple with 3 yrs old child) called about a potential water leak because the bill was so high.

We stopped by and discovered the pool (that's what caused high water bill). Plus, the little girl told us their dog died in the pool the night before. The tenants didn't tell us that part.

We told them to rid of it that day or expect eviction notice. Several hours later, we came back and saw that the pool was gone. They continued to live at the house for another 1.5 years with no further problem.

BSH--although your hubby said yes, it is NOT too late to "change mind". There is absolutely no justifiable reason to feel that you should allow a "stellar tenant" to have a pool.

Debbie

PS - why would a tenant be willing to fork extra money to remove pool and fence? Think about that.

[StepUp]

This situation serves as a reminder the importance of having your tenants purchase and maintain their own renters insurance policy, with the requisite liability coverage. Also, you as the landlord should be named as an additional insured under the renter's policy. Thus, if any "surprise" pools, pitbulls, etc. show up and a problem ensues, the landlord has excellent protection. This advise comes from 20 years in insurance claims and, as a new landlord, one who's in the process of buying an umbrella policy, too.

Eric

[Dan Auito]

Sound advice!

[SPIVALAW]

Pool drownings # 2 reason of small childrens deaths.

Tell them, Darn it, you would, but your Investorss said the Ins company said no.

Tenants barley pay rent, they wont carry liability ins.

[Aldo]

The very fact that you permit a pool makes you liable for any 'accidents', even if indirectly.

Being named as an 'additional insured' on a tenant's Renter's Insurance policy isn't as great as purported. Even a claim that is fully covered by a tenant's insurance which includes you as an 'additional insured' will affect your insurability and/or premium rates because that claim will be added to your C.L.U.E. report.

C.L.U.E. reporting is a very complex issue. There was an excellent thread about this last year which I wasn't able to easily locate or I'd have included a link. Basically. it is an extremely comprehensive report which contains much of your personal info and is used by insurers to gauge your insurability. An example of things which are included is a simple call to your insurance agent to ask if your policy covers (whatever).

Bad things do happen to good people, so don't allow the pool and, for heaven's sake, don't call your insurer unless absolutely necessary.

[StepUp]

Excellent advice, Aldo. I always tell anyone in a claim situation to use your insurance as a last resort. If you can afford to fix it yourself, do it! If you bumped into the car in front of you, bite the bullet and pay for the repairs. However, when facing a lawsuit, we as property/business owners have more assets at stake than most others. The thought of a bulldog plaintiff attorney piercing entities we own to expose our assets is a disturbing one. Don't think it can't happen to you. Making an insurance claim can and will have negative ramifications; are those ramifications more or less than what you are willing to potentially lose in a long, expensive lawsuit?

Eric

[Debbie]

There was an excellent thread about this last year which I wasn't able to easily locate or I'd have included a link.

Aldo, I found them!

Here's the links, starting with Aldo's thread on C.L.U.E.

http://www.magicbullets.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3037&highlight=clue

http://www.magicbullets.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3477&highlight=clue

http://www.magicbullets.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3980&highlight=clue

[Aldo]

Somehow I knew you would. Thanx, Debbie

[BSH]

Thank you so very much for all of your helpful comments. You all simply confirmed what my gut was telling me already. I'm going to have to tell her no to the pool, and she'll just have to figure out how to live with it.

Thanks again!!!

:SM023: :praise: :thumbup:

[SPIVALAW]

the beach and club house pools can satisfy her desires.

[mileycyan]

I once had a similar situation. I told them no but hey put it up anyway. I should have been more stern with my answer but I blamed not letting her put it up on the HOA. It does state no above ground pools.

She put it up for only a few months (summer) and did not put it back up again the next year. The only real problem is there is now a bare circle spot where there was once grass.

[gabe]

I Will Tell You A Story:

I Work On A House Where The Above Ground Pool,due To Rain,over Filled And Broke.the Water Didn't Go Into The House But It Did Go Under The House And Caused A Mold Issue.this Was A Major Issue Because At The Time I Was Not Aware That Mold Can Eat Wood And Can Cause Health Issue.i Don't Know About Your Area But In Some Counties In Califoria It Is Acually Aginst Certain Codes To Have An Above Ground Pool. I Know In One Case Where A Lady Took It To Court And Said If I Put The Over Ground Pool In The Ground Would That Apply With The Local Code,she Won.under The Condition That A Licence Contractor Did The Install.

That Is My Story I Hope It Help(i Know It Is Kind Of Negitive,sorry)


Gabe